Why Our Multiracial, Adoptive Family Left the White Evangelical Church

Once upon a time, I grew up in church.  And so did my husband. 

Red carpet, wooden pews, 500-page hymnals, church lake baptisms, summer VBS, KJV Bibles, no-sex-until-marriage, pasty-white-Jesus church.   

Maybe you can relate?  

Once Steve and I were married, we continued to attend church.  Since our wedding day, which was over fifteen years ago (!!!), we have been part of four churches.   As our family grew, and as we learned and evolved, we changed churches when we felt it was necessary for the spiritual health of our family.   

So when did we leave the white evangelical church, and why?  

I had felt a longing, for some time, to find a multicultural, woke, relevant, authentic church that taught our children the faith values we adamantly believed in.  These include:  eternal life and a rich earthly life comes through salvation (choosing to accept Jesus' sacrifice on the cross); that we are to love God and love others; that certain Biblical traditions are important to follow including communion, baptism, prayer, learning God's word (the Bible), and community.  

Then there was 2016.

We had just adopted our fourth child when the 2016 election took place.  I wasn't worried.  I was certain that people would understand and clearly see that now-#45 was not for most people, including women, people of color, those with disabilities, those dreaming of coming to live in the U.S.  As Maya Angelou famously said, "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time."

Of course, we all know what happened.   

It was the very next morning after the election that I felt this sense of anger that I couldn't shake.  Not over a few days, or a few weeks, or now, even after a few years.  I just cannot make peace with where our country is.   

I know, Bible peeps are reminding me of John 16:33:  "I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world."

The political climate just felt and still feels so...personal.  Every tweet from the not-presidential President.  Every audio and video clip.  The social media responses.  The election signs on people's cars and in their yards.  Those MAGA hats (Jesus, help me).  

Then there were the right-wing social media trolls who left racist comments about my children on Twitter.  Disgusting, vile things meant to rattle us.  Where did these trolls come from?  I don't know, but they sure crawled out of their hole in early 2017.

I wasn't naive. I didn't think that any other candidate would save the world.  But I did feel that others had more experience, more history, and certainly, better morals, ethics, and standards. 

Then the reports.  Overwhelmingly, white evangelicals were backing up this President and continued to do so, even though he paid off a porn star (and cheated on his wife), even though he bragged about grabbing women inappropriately, even though he chucked paper towels at people of color who were in dire need of shelter and water, even though he made fun of a reporter with a disability, even when he mocked a woman after she testified that she had been sexually assaulted by the then Supreme Court judge nominee, even when he called one woman "horseface" and another a "dog."  I could list dozens of examples, but let's move on. 

Now, I am not throwing our previous church homes under the proverbial bus.  There were some wonderful, woke, empathetic, kind people among us.  

But what was missing was so important:  people of color in leadership, an acknowledgement of the pain people in our country were facing, conversations about how to be more inclusive and welcoming of others beyond just "say hello to the person next to you."  We were always encouraged to invite friends and family to our church events, but how could we invite friends of color when they'd stand out so much among a sea of white congregants?  

I know this to be true:  when you aren't represented, you know it.  You feel it.  You see it.  And others do too, even if they don't say so.  

And it's really awkward, uncomfortable, and often offensive.  

We worked hard, very hard, to find a diverse church.  But when I asked church leadership about their diversity, many would say yes, their church was diverse.  But then we'd visit and there'd be maybe two multiracial families (almost always at least one of them was an adoptive family).  Or when I'd ask about diversity, the leadership response would be "we're working on that."  

What does that even mean?  Working on diversity?  

I didn't want to be the token multiracial family who would suddenly appear on the church website or social media feed in order for that church to prove they were welcoming of people of all races.

Thanks, but no thanks. 

Yes, I'm skeptical.  White America, which exists everywhere, even in church, and today is SUPPORTED BY people who claim to be Christian, makes me very uncomfortable.  

It's not that we believe a church has to change their values based on current events.  But BECAUSE of current events, the church should step up their already proclaimed values.  

After an exhaustive search for the perfect (or even slightly flawed) diverse church, we realized it just didn't exist.  So we decided to attend a church I had heard about once from our girls' first mentor. 

A Black church.

My main hesitation was not standing out as two white adults with four Black kids, or the scrutiny we might face, as we so often do, for being a multiracial family.   Were we good enough to parent Black children?  What were our motives?  

No. 

My main hesitation was this:  were we inappropriately taking up seats in a safe, Black, sacred space?  How would congregants and staff feel seeing two white adults sitting in a church service, many of them not even knowing we had four Black children in children's church?  Were we invading a space that was not meant for us, and rightfully so?

It's not our space.  It's not our place. This is what I told myself in the days leading up to the Sunday we planned to attend for the first time.

But as parents-by-transracial-adoption, it's not even close to being all about us (as the parents).  It's about the kids and the family unit.  

We ultimately decided that we were making this choice for our children.  Not attending church wasn't an option for us.  Attending a church that treated my family as tokens also wasn't an option.  Attending a church that preached love but not standing up to injustice wasn't an option.  Silence is compliance.

To be honest, we felt we were out of options.  If this church didn't work for us, we were done searching.  Because searching is exhausting.

And it turns out, being "out of options" is a really GOOD place to be sometimes.  

I don't mean to say the church we attend was our last choice or last resort.  It wasn't.  We actually re-discovered it at the tail-end of our search (the search we about gave up on).  I talked to the girls mentor about it, and then a friend (fellow mom-by-adoption) who had recently attended with her Black daughter.  But I was holding back out of respect for the church.

I messaged the church admin to ask questions.  She hooked me up with the children's ministry coordinator, in which I asked many more questions.   They both said to me, when are you coming?

It was time.

The experience was amazing.   The church was so ALIVE.  The music, the preaching, the people.  People were hugging us on the FIRST day we attended.  Introducing themselves to my kids.  Not a single whisper, second-glance, or sigh.

So we went back again.  And again.  And again.

A few weeks in, a woman stopped me, my husband, and my second daughter after service and asked if she could talk to our daughter.  We were bewildered, but agreed.  The woman bent down and looked into my daughter's eyes and said, "You are very beautiful.  I want you to know that."  

My daughter (an introvert) quietly replied, "Thank you."   

A few weeks later, my oldest kept telling me she wanted new glasses "like that lady at church."  I had no clue who she was talking about, as there are hundreds of women at church.  Then the next Sunday, my daughter discreetly pointed out an usher, a young woman with fashionable, clear glasses.  So after church, we approached her and told her how much we loved her glasses, and my daughter had a similar pair on order.  The young woman was so sweet to my daughter, telling her she couldn't wait to see her new glasses.

These may seem like small things, but small things add up. 

The truth is, we feel really safe in a church where we are surrounded by people who look like our kids.  I don't worry if someone is petting my girls' braids or interrogating them ("How long did that take?  Did you have to sit still for hours?").  Not ONCE have we been asked if we're the babysitters, the foster parents, or even the "adoptive" parents.  My kids love that their teachers are Black.  

We sit in the sanctuary with so much appreciation.  There's no bashfulness or lengthy explanations for being concerned about another white person calling the police on a Black person for ridiculous things, another shooting of an unarmed Black person, a tweet from #45 that is so clearly racist.   We don't worry about an off-handed comment that sounds like it came straight from a Fox news anchor.  

Because we are all concerned.  Because we all see it for what it is.  

My kids are happy, safe, and embraced.  What more could we ask for as parents?  

And we leave church feeling like we learned.  We learned about God.  We learned about the Bible.  We learned about being better parents and spouses.  

We leave encouraged.  We leave better.  

Not tired.  Not tolerated.  Not used.  

It's incredible.  

If you're feeling lost in today's culture, I completely get it.  You can even be like us:  know who you are and what you want, but struggle SO much to find a house of worship to support and refine that.  

If you're searching for the right church for your family, please do not give up.  Because we almost gave up.  And if we would have, we would have been even more lost, confused, and hurt.  

Keep looking.  Keep asking questions.  Keep pursuing. Make an effort.  Visit churches.  

And don't feel guilty for leaving the white evangelical church if that's what your family needs. 

You were CHOSEN to parent your children.  You were CHOSEN to do what's best for them.  And that doesn't stop on Sunday mornings.  

Multiracial, Multicultural Family Life: A Conversation with Diedre Anthony

"Are they all yours?" asked the stranger standing behind me in the checkout line.  She gestured toward the four children with me:  two arguing, one attempting to smell all the gum packets, and the other squealing loudly (just for the fun of it).

I wanted to say, "What do you think? I don't bring four random kids to the store to have a good time."   But I don't, even though I'm tired and irritated.  Instead I just say, "Yes they are!" and then turn my attention back to reminding my son to put the gum packets back where they belong. 

We attract attention and always have, since the day our very first child joined our family.   With the addition of each child, the attention increased:  second glances, questions, smiles.  Not all attention is bad, but it's not something we crave.  We really are just a normal family who does normal things and lives a normal life.  And taking four kids anywhere is an adventure, so I'm mainly focused on making sure we stay together as a group and maintain some sort of sanity. 

Diedre Anthony, author of the blog Are Those Your Kids?, is in a similar situation.  As a mom of two (soon-to-be three!) and a Black woman married to a white man, she's no stranger to questions and comments.  Yet this mama has been rockin' it, taking her passion and knowledge and channeling them into a Facebook group, e-book, and, of course, her blog.  And today, she's offering us some insight on caring for Black hair and navigating multiracial family life.

Rachel:  Earlier this year, you started a Facebook group for moms in multiracial families.  Why did you think this was important?  What do you love about your group?  What do you hope members gain by participating?  

Diedre:  Being in a multiracial family brings unique challenges that monoracial families can't relate to. We often face criticism or have questions about life happenings that can be difficult to find the answers to. I wanted to create a space that was safe to share these challenges and a place to provide answers and additional resources for multiracial families.

I think what makes my group different from many others is the fact that I screen members and spend a lot of time moderating conversations.  I love that everyone comes to the table with unique ideas, opinions, and experiences, but I allow everyone to express their opinions without being offensive or pushy with other members. I have been known to turn off commenting on a post if I felt like the conversation was taking a negative turn. 

I like for my group to be a positive and supportive place. The word is filled with so much negativity. My group will not add to that.  

Rachel:  You are Black, your husband is white, your girls (and baby-on-the-way) are bi-racial.   What's the best thing about being a multiracial family?  What's the most challenging?  

Diedre:  I love that we are truly a melting pot. My husband was born and raised in South Georgia. His family has traditions that he shares with me, and I share the traditions and food of my Jamaican family with him. We've been lucky because our families love us and get along. We've spent many holidays together and we are raising our children in a beautifully blended multiracial/multicultural family.  

Rachel:  Tell me about your new e-book!   Why did you write it?  What will readers get from it? Where can we buy it? 

Diedre:  In my Facebook group and on the blog, I get a lot of questions about curly hair care. As a naturally curly girl myself, I understand the struggle! There are so many products on the market that it's difficult to know which one to choose, and can be frustrating when you've spent a significant amount of money on products and none of them work. 

You can purchase the e-book here.  

Rachel:  You grew up as a military child.  How did your childhood experiences shape you in terms of diversity, acceptance, and racial-confidence? 

Diedre:  I absolutely loved my upbringing! My friends were a mixture of races and cultures and that was my normal. When someone new moved into town, it was almost a battle to see who could be friends with them first. I was always intrigued by their latest travels and where they had been in the world. I loved when my neighbors came back from overseas and brought candy and food from wherever they were. It was always an adventure!

My parents both came from Jamaica as teens, so they faced some discrimination when they came to the States. They taught me to be polite to others and eat at least a little of what you are offered, even if it doesn't look appetizing. I learned to appreciate other cultures based on my upbringing. 

Rachel:  For fellow multiracial families, whether built by biology or adoption, when we encounter someone who is condescending, judgmental, nosy, or critical, what is the BEST way to respond when our kids are watching our every move and listening to our every word?  

Diedre:  To me, it's sad that people still expect everyone in the family to look alike. Even in monoracial families, there will be kids that just don't look like their parents. We are in 2018 and things have changed so dramatically in our world, that it really surprises me when people are shocked by my family dynamics. As my children age, I think I will tell them (if they ask) that people ask about our family dynamics because maybe they don't get out much :)

While they are little, I will just respond with yes they are my children. When you are out in public with your children, sometimes the questions don't come at the most convenient time. I know some of my more sarcastic responses come when I'm already frustrated with my children. But it is important to me to remain calm and in control. I want my kids to see that ignorance does not control my response and that I am ultimately in control of my emotions.

I think the best response is going to vary by comfort level. I definitely would not encourage being rude, especially because your children are watching.I would answer that yes, they are my children and then change the subject or walk away. I think that sends a pretty clear message that the conversation is over and inappropriate. Walking away is perfect when you are in a store (which is where this typically happens to me). You don't owe this stranger anything. 

Rachel:  How do you build your children's racial confidence?  How do affirm them racially?   

Diedre:  We read A LOT. I surround them with diversity through books in our home, and even with toys. They have dolls in just about every race available. It's also important to me that we break gender and cultural stereotypes. They have toys like microscopes, trucks, and cars. We eat at ethnic restaurants. Growing up on an Air Force Base taught me that this was normal. So this is how I raise my kids. 

Diedre's daughters reading our book: POEMS FOR THE SMART, SPUNKY, AND SENSATIONAL BLACK GIRL

Dear Sugar: Meet Meghan Joy Yancy, Mom of a Big, Beautiful, Multiracial Family

Dear Sugar:

I have a mad mommy crush on MJY's Instagram account. Every day, she's posting a photo of her gorgeous family and of the must-own cool new products for moms and kids.  So today it's my honor to share my interview with her:

Lindsay Marcus Photography

Rachel:  How did you meet your husband?  What was it like dating inter-racially?   

MJY:  I went to cosmetology school after high school and had no idea how I would even meet my husband. And it's always cool how God works because I met my husband in the most unsuspecting place. I knew who he was, but was never really interested in him. I saw him around, but was not into him. He was my brother's teammate on their college basketball team. We saw each other out one night, began chatting via Facebook and quite possibly began falling in love the night of my brother's wedding. 4 months after dating, we were engaged and we were married 8 months later. I was freshly 21 years old at the time and wasn't really aware of how the world viewed interracial couples. I just knew that I loved him. And that's all I cared about. When I began to see prejudice rear it's ugly head throughout the years, it was disgustingly surprising, but also has really allowed me the stretching room to rise above the haters. 

Rachel:  You and your husband have five children.  Obviously big families attract attention, but a big multiracial family?  Even more attention.  (In fact, that's my family too!)  Tell me, what are the biggest joys and challenges of being a big, multiracial family?  

MJY: It's so funny you say that because there are so many times we will be out and about in public with all of us and it is so blatant that everyone is staring at us. It often feels like we are unknowingly walking on a red carpet and all eyes are on us. It can feel awkward but most of the time, my husband and I just look at each other and giggle. I would say some of the challenges would be the remarks. I've been asked if I do daycare or foster care. As if it would be so odd for me to have 5 mixed race children. But really, the comments don't bother me by any means, but pave a way for us to have some great growth discussions with the kids. Some of the biggest joys are seeing each of their personalities come through. Learning their passions in life, what makes them tick and experiencing each of their unique attributes. I've watched my 8 year old daughter explain to another little girl why she is darker skinned and why her mommy is white. She answered with such elegance, grace and kindness. 

Rachel:  What's your approach when responding to nosy questions or intrusive (and unwelcome) comments?  

MJY:  I've always wanted to be super witty and make the other person feel ridiculously uncomfortable but I'm never quite quick enough to come up with something good. Instead, I usually just brush it off. I don't need to absorb someone else's nonsense and let it affect my mood. More often then not, we get many nice comments and loving glances, so it's not something we have to deal with too often. I run errands with just me and the kids often and I usually assume people just think I am the nanny. When people do ask if they are all mine, their response is shock and disbelief and they respond with some sort of "Wow, your hands are full!" or "Better you than me!" or along the lines of "Bless your soul." *Insert eye roll* and move on.

Lindsay Marcus Photography

Rachel:  Your website and social media seem to be all about one thing:  joy.  Tell me about how you chose a theme and how that theme manifests in what you do.   

MJY:  Well, my middle is JOY. It's been a part of me since birth and I've truly just always been aware and in pursuit of finding joy and living in joy. God has done some really cool things in my life and given me such a natural positive outlook on life and He has shown me the beauty in living with joy today. Right now. When I began putting together my website and social media, it all flowed very naturally. I didn't have to think about what it would all be about because it is one of the biggest part of me. Joy is always on my heart, always on my mind and something I am intentional about living in. I love being able to share that with others, and seeing joy manifest in their own lives. Maybe at first, beginning as something they need to really work at, and then, becoming a habitual every day part of their life.

Rachel:  What's next for your family?

MJY:  Prayerfully.... baby number 6! Still waiting on that and in the meantime, keeping busy with homeschooling, settling into our new house and I am currently working on writing my first book. It is all about finding joy in today and I'm really excited to see it all come into being. We will also be welcoming some exchange students into our home this year so it will be very fun for the kids and us to learn about some other cultures while also being able to show our own family culture to them. I enjoy keeping up with my blog, Instagram and my essential oil business and am so blessed I get do it all from home while raising the kids. 

Thank you for letting me be a part of this wonderful series. I love getting connected with other multi-racial families and hearing their experiences and be unified in our beautiful differences. I am honored to be amongst you all. 

  Meghan and her husband, Seborn, live in Minneapolis, Minnesota with their 5 childen (so far.) Although living in the cul-de-sac in their suburban town, they lead a slower paced life as Meghan has mastered the art of "No." They sit around for a family meal every night and ultimately end up sweeping the floors approximately 5-9 times every day. Life is beautiful and a blessing and they live that with certainty during a daily dance party. Meghan homeschools their children while running her businesses from home. She is currently writing her first book while Seborn works as an assistant principal and real estate agent. You will most often find them playing in the backyard in the summers or cozied up by the fire in the Minnesota winters. 

Dear Sugar: On Multiracial Motherhood, From Diedre Anthony's Point of View

Dear Sugar:

Today I'm introducing you to one of my newest favorite people, Diedre Anthony.  Diedre is the author of a fabulous up-and-coming blog called Are Those Your Kids?  And if you follow me on Facebook, Diedre and I have made multiple appearances together on Facebook Live, talking about hair, nosy strangers, school, and much more.  

What I love about Diedre (pronounced Day-dra) is her authenticity.  What you see-hear-read is what you get.  She's also incredibly supportive of fellow multiracial families, running a Facebook group just for moms like me (and you?).   

Rachel:  Tell me about yourself. 

Diedre:  I've been a school counselor for 10 years...a middle school one for 6 of those years. I guess you can say that has prepared me to deal with drama :) 

I live in Statesboro, Georgia, a small town 45 minutes from Savannah, Georgia. Thanks to the college, it has brought diversity to our town. I met my husband here while in graduate school. He was born and raised here. We have been married for 7 years and dated for 3 years prior to getting married. We met while folding shirts in the men's department at JCPenney. 

I'm an "Air Force brat" but I grew up on the same base for the majority of my life. Looking at my group of friends was like looking at the United Nations. The base brought a variety of cultures and races together. Diversity was our way of life. 

I have 2 daughters ages 3 and 5 going on ages 16 and 21. They both have very different textures of hair. Trying to figure out what worked best in their hair is what prompted me to start my blog, Are Those Your Kids. I couldn't find many resources for biracial kids, so I decided to be that resource for others. 

In my free time I love to write, shop for makeup and hair products (I'm a self proclaimed product junkie) and read.

Rachel:  What is the mission of your blog, Are Those Your Kids? 

Diedre:  To empower multiracial families with resources and help them navigate the journey of raising biracial children. Having a multiracial family poses some unique challenges that monoracial families never have to consider. All sorts of questions arise and parents are looking for some guidance to answer them. Questions like, what if my child is the only minority in their class? Or what if someone asks what my child is? Or what if a kid makes fun of my child's lunch because it's culturally different? 

Rachel:  You and I have discussed this top at length on Facebook Live, because our followers LOVE talking about this topic.   But I'll ask again:  how do you react when someone makes an inappropriate remark or asks an absurd question about your multiracial family? 

Diedre:  I usually respond with some level of sarcasm if I feel like they are being intrusive or mean spirited. If they are asking questions, I usually follow up with a question like, what do you mean? Or why do you say that? Sometimes that stops the conversation from going to uncomfortable places.

Rachel:   Let's talk about hair!  Give me your single best hair tip and your top three favorite products right now. 

Diedre:  Wow, just 1? That's tough! I guess my best tip would be to do the majority of curly hair styling while the hair is soaking wet or damp. This makes detangling and styling so much easier. My top 3 favorite products are the Mane Choice Shampoo/conditioner, Mielle Organics Babassu Oil and Mint Deep Conditioner and; Shea Moisture Curl Gel Souffle. 

Rachel:  What's your favorite quote, verse, book, song, tv show, or movie about race? 

Diedre:  I would have to say either India Arie's "I Am Not My Hair" or Michael Jackson "Black or White."

Find Diedre on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram.

-This post contains Amazon affiliate links.    

Dear Sugar: Three Offensive Things White People Do to Black Kids That Needs to Stop

Dear Sugar, 

Today's post really isn't for you.  It's for those around you (maybe even your nearest-and-dearest, your child's white teacher or coach, etc.) who might be doing some things that really aren't cool.   So, here goes, an authentic, upfront, firm "no no" list for those around you who may be screwing up when it comes to interacting with your kids.  So share it, send it, print it (and hand it over).  Whatever you need to do.   

1:  Touch their hair.

Our children are not pets. They are people.  Their hair is part of their body and shouldn't be touched without consent (and wouldn't it be weird to ask to touch a child's hair anyway)?   A white person touching a Black child's hair is a microaggression. A microaggression is:"a subtle but offensive comment or action at a minority or other nondominant 
group that is often unintentional or 
unconsciously reinforces a stereotype."  

Yes, I understand that patting a child on the head or touching hair is meant to be endearing (and you'll argue, I do the same to a child of ANY color), but when it's a white adult (or person) touching a Black child, a line is crossed.   Plus your dirty hands in my child's cornrows (braids that took me two hours or more to do) is disrespectful of my child's body and of the time and energy we put in to doing her hair.   

Hair is a really big deal in the Black community and has much significance in Black culture.  You may not fully (or even partially) understand this.   You don't need to really "get it."  You just need to respect my child enough not to pet her.  

I get that you might be really curious about Black hair, but the way to gain answers to your questions isn't to pluck up a beaded braid, which is attached to my child's head, and fondle.  That's just weird. So stop.


2:  Gush over the child's appearance.  


I know, you are trying to compliment.  But when a white person reduces a child to his or her appearance by gushing over skin tone and hair, it's called festishizing (and it's disturbing and creepy). The "compliment" is usually over-the-top: the compliment repeated multiple times to where it gets really, really uncomfortable.  It's often done to bi-racial kids, kids who were adopted transracially, and children who have intricate hairstyles.  

In my experience, it's done more often to girls than boys; girls already are overly complimented on their appearance, but with girls of color, it's done even more.  

Our children aren't objects to be admired and reduced, especially not by a white person.  And frankly, all the attention makes many kids really uncomfortable. 

I wrote an article last year about the one thing you should say to a family like mine (a family built by adoption) that is perfectly fine and appreciated.  Notice that I do not invite you to pet my child or do anything listed in point #3.   Just keep it simple (and preferably not creepy).  

3: Interrogate.  

One of the questions that most bothers my children is when white people, usually women, first try to touch their hair and then follow that up with, "HOW LONG DID THAT TAKE?" and "HOW CAN YOU SIT THAT LONG?"  (Or, "Oh, I get it, girlfriend! I have curly hair myself."  No.  Just no.)  

Usually my girls just give weirdo-stranger a look (of both annoyance and bewilderment).  Like, I don't even know you, you get in my personal space and touch part of my body without permission, and then proceed to ask me questions.  You peppering my children with your white person questions and curious touches goes against everything that every parent teaches their child: stranger awareness and stranger danger.  As an adult, you should know better!   My children's Blackness and your whiteness (and my whiteness too) isn't an invitation to begin your round of questioning (and touching).  


Other questions might be about their adoption stories, their parents' race(s) ("Oh, so is your dad Black?"), their racial makeup ("So are you mixed?"). Additionally, questions or comments embedded in stereotypes aren't appreciated.  Like, "I bet you love basketball" or "Do you like rap music?" My kids don't exist to be your Black Google.  

Listen, I know you are going to tell me you are just trying to be friendly.  You are a nice person.  You love children.   Great!  I like people who are nice to my kids!  But as a white person, please recognize that there are some rules that apply to an interaction between a white adult and a Black child. You may not like the rules (ahem, white fragility) and have a hard time grasping them.  

But guess what?  It's not all about you.   

Love, Rachel